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Tesra x Nnoitra FC [v4]: Higher than the Moon

Yomihime

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Yo, sorry for the late reply! Great response as always :whoops

Harribel may not be devouring them, no, but she doesn't precisely show her care either. Commenting after their defeat is not the same as trying to protect them. Her heart still weeps for those she lost in the first place.
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Any female Hollow could stand in for the daughters she lost initially. Her girls are replaceable, and so she does not need to protect them. She can always find more. It's a nicer version of Szayelaporro's statement that he can make a replacement for the Fraccion he devoured. So long as he can make another, he doesn't need to protect the ones he has.

Characters protect what is valuable to them: their hearts. Hollows are Hollow precisely because they lack that which they want to protect. Yet we see Nnoitra protecting someone. So where does Nnoitra's heart lie?
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It's a different bond than the other Espada have with their Fraccion. Nnoitra found what he lost in the first place. Whatever that might mean in the bigger context of the story, of course.
IMO comparing Harribel with Szayelaporro is a bit harsh. Why would Harribel devoured her Fraccion if she gains nothing out of it? In my mind they're just... really, really different. That reminds me, the databook said Harribel appreciated Starrk's relationship with Lilynette and detested Szayelaporro for selfishly devouring his Fraccion. From this, I think it's clear that Kubo is trying to show us Harribel's maternal attachment towards her pseudo-daughters. The main difference between her and Nnoitra is that the latter is very vocal about his own feelings.

Anyway, a Fraccion is Espada's right-hand men, it's not unusual to throw them on battlefield. If Nnoitra treats his like his own long lost heart, that's another (romantic) story :amuse

I don't know about that. They sat together to watch Ichigo and plan the attack, and it seems likely that they did same prior to attacking Chad since Tesra didn't pop up until after the initial attack. Was the plan always that Nnoitra would keep any prey, or was Tesra supposed to take over after a certain point? He didn't seem surprised that Nnoitra handed the kid off to him, and we just saw the Vulture Girls tag-teaming to deal with Zaraki in a perfectly-parallel situation.
I don't recall that bolded part. Nnoitra scolded Tesra for shielding him and kicked Tesra for letting go of Orihime, so I suppose it wasn't truly a planned strategy.

Especially in HM where the one who makes the kill get the prey, I am inclined to say it was always the plan for Tesra to finish Ichigo (or any other likely strong target) off. He had asked about Chad, after all (essentially repeating Nanao's actions toward Chad one arc earlier).
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The whole situation with Chad came down to: "Don't waste your strength on small fry like that."
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I would say there is a heavy implication that Tesra probably could have handled Ichigo sooner if need be, that he probably is close to if not equal to Nnoitra's strength (like the situation with Ikkaku&Yumichika or Yamamoto&Sasakibe). Nnoitra did choose someone suitable for Tesra to fight, after all.

Battlefields are a dangerous place; Ichigo always pushes his friends aside when it's time to fight. Tesra certainly worries about something happening to Nnoitra even though he does know that under normal circumstances nothing can possibly damage Nnoitra. It goes both ways; Nnoitra doesn't want anything to happen to Tesra either. It's something unique to them out of the antagonist roster. Hero and nakama worry about each other; villains don't (normally).
Tesra was beating a battered Ichigo after all, he was OHKO'd by Zaraki upon their first meeting.

I have noticed this parallel since a long time. Of course, why would anyone use their full power to defeat a small fry? I remember one thing, Nnoitra used to torch villages to recruit VL, right? Isn't that the same thing as "wasting your strength on small fry"? I wonder what changed him like that? I guess Tesra has humanized Nnoitra for decades :amuse

Power levels are irrelevant around here. Even if there were four others ranked above him, I don't think there was a real difference in power there. The only thing that is important is the strength of one's bonds, a strong heart (as per vol 54 poem).

If Nnoitra has the strongest bond, that is all that matters as far as power goes.
Then what was the difference between his other four seniors? :headscratch

Sorry for the short responses, I'm not used to write wall of text :(

Edit: Oh Minerva, congratulations for your 2000th post Nnoitra badge! :applause I wonder if it was intentional :heehee
 
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IMO comparing Harribel with Szayelaporro is a bit harsh. Why would Harribel devoured her Fraccion if she gains nothing out of it? In my mind they're just... really, really different. That reminds me, the databook said Harribel appreciated Starrk's relationship with Lilynette and detested Szayelaporro for selfishly devouring his Fraccion. From this, I think it's clear that Kubo is trying to show us Harribel's maternal attachment towards her pseudo-daughters. The main difference between her and Nnoitra is that the latter is very vocal about his own feelings.
I feel that Harribel and her group are typical of relationships between Hollows. Their followers are intended as a replacement for what they lost. It is like Rukongai, that they will all make-do with such companions as they can find. If one dies though, they will simply continue to make-do and find a suitable replacement when they can. Szayelaporro simply carries it to an extreme in killing his own followers and replacing them at will. I don't think Harribel would ever go that far, but should something happen to her girls, she could find more girls to take in. She will fill the void in her soul as best as she can, even if it's not an exact fit. That is the entire point of Hollow devouring each other. They must do what they can to fill that void, and sometimes -- once in a while -- they find another soul that eases their pain another way. It isn't a perfect fit, but they manage. Harribel has her girls, Yammy has his dog at his side, Nel's brothers will play with her forever.

It's different with Nnoitra. There is no possible way for Kubo's little sketch to be accurate unless Tesra is actually the person Nnoitra lost. That piece of Nnoitra's heart should be long gone, like every other Hollow's "missing piece". No other Hollow (or soul in Rukongai, etc) ever finds what they lost. He regained the one he lost though. Why would he not let the entire universe know how he feels? :amuse It is such a rare feat in Bleachverse that Kubo really must go back to pick up the loose ends of their story. Yamamoto found the person who made him whole (and they got killed off). Isshin and Masaki were literally bound together (and then she died to protect Ichigo). Ichigo (whatever Kubo wants to do with Ichigo's yet-unofficial soul-mate). And this. That is all so far. Everyone else seems to be at loose ends and out of luck.

I don't recall that bolded part. Nnoitra scolded Tesra for shielding him and kicked Tesra for letting go of Orihime, so I suppose it wasn't truly a planned strategy.
Here:
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Tesra was with him the entire time, same as before they found Chad. The plans seems to be along the lines of "I'll wear him, then you can have him". Tesra asked about the defeated Chad, and was told that one was too weak to bother with. It's certainly a nicer situation than the SR girls squabbling over who gets [strike]the last slice of pizza[/strike] the defeated Zaraki. Nnoitra gave away all rights to the kill; how gentlemanly of him! :love

Tesra was beating a battered Ichigo after all, he was OHKO'd by Zaraki upon their first meeting.
I don't think it's quite that simple.

The fandom seems to have collectively decided that the SR girls were smart to stalk a weary opponent. It's a war, and it gives them an advantage, so why not?

How is that different from Nnoitra&Tesra stalking Ichigo and waiting from Grimmjow to wear him out? It would take more effort to deal with a fresh opponent, and it doesn't necessarily imply they couldn't take him down sooner. It would just be a lot more work. Let Grimmjow do the work here so they can reap the rewards. If they showed up in Aizen's throne room with Ichigo's remains, what would Aizen and/or the Hogyoku have granted them? Ichigo was really going to die there if Zaraki hadn't shown up.

Also: I don't think Tesra being cut down by Zaraki is quite as simple as it seems. As with Yamamoto&Sasakibe, his powers are intended to be the opposite of Nnoitra's. Whereas Nnoitra concentrates on defence, Tesra's powers are for offence. (See: Glass Canon and Stone Wall.) He is the one with special attacks, not Nnoitra.

If he (hypothetically, of course, since we don't know) traded away his Hierro to the Hogyoku for the power to protect Nnoitra, of course he could be cut down easily. Ichigo could have cut him down if he had managed to pull himself together. Inoue could have done serious damage if she weren't too cowed to fight back. I believe that is the point of his powers. So long as his opponents are too cowed to fight him, he doesn't actually need a shield/armour.

Someone like Zaraki who isn't intimated by flexing muscles obviously can and will take him down though. I don't think it's intended as a slam on his strength that Zaraki cut him down; it's just how his powers work. The best defence is a good offence. :elmo Besides, it becomes Nnoitra's cue to step in and protect him if he really is going to get hurt.

I have noticed this parallel since a long time. Of course, why would anyone use their full power to defeat a small fry? I remember one thing, Nnoitra used to torch villages to recruit VL, right? Isn't that the same thing as "wasting your strength on small fry"? I wonder what changed him like that? I guess Tesra has humanized Nnoitra for decades :amuse
You don't need a jackhammer to kill a fly, no. :XD

It is truly the difference between killing just to kill and killing with a purpose. Anyone can cut down an entire village just because they got bored. A warrior only does such things when necessary and to target those who are worthy opponents; everyone else gets just enough power to stop the battle (see: Chad x Ground). We know Nnoitra wasn't using all the powers he could access until Zaraki forced his hand. He could have killed Ichigo any time he felt like it; instead, he did just enough to determine if this kid was worth Tesra's time and strength. It's like Zaraki saving his full strength for his Worthy Opponents. If they're weak, why waste strength on them?

He certainly changed his world-view after Tesra showed up.

Then what was the difference between his other four seniors? :headscratch
We had it from Shunsui that there was no real difference in between 1, 2, and 3.
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The fandom makes a big deal of Four and higher not releasing under the Dome, but I think the restriction is more a means to reduce damage to the structure. Starrk has his huge cero attacks. Baraggan at full power rots everything away. Harribel has her huge water attacks. Ulquiorra destroyed 1/3 of the Dome by himself.

What does Nnoitra have for innate techniques? A non-invasive locating kidou. :XD His powers aren't destructive like the others, so why restrict him? Tesra is the destructive one. He's not an Espada though, so much like Ikkaku and his bankai not being restricted in the Human world, Tesra isn't under a limitation.

There is a definite cut-off below Nnoitra though. 4 of the top 5 have huge weapons (like Ichigo and Zaraki), which is the usual marker for huge power. From what Kubo has indicated in interviews, I suspect Ulquiorra was originally #5 and was switched with Nnoitra on some whim of Kubo's. That would put Nnoitra over with the other huge-weapon wielders.

Really, I think Espada power levels are a lot more fluid than the fandom would like to believe. They're all roughly around the same level of power (VL-level), perhaps a slight difference between 10 through 6. The upper ranks are dependent on hax powers, not strength per se. Nnoitra took out Nelliel when she was five ranks higher. Anyone ranked above Nnoitra should easily be fair game, if it came to that. I don't think there's a real difference between him and Starrk, say, provided Nnoitra could simply tank all the cero attacks (and let Tesra go deal the actual damage while Starrk is distracted).

The fact of having the strongest Hierro means he can withstand anything thrown at him. This is his power. As long as he remains standing, he wins. It took something very special from Zaraki to defeat him; no one else could have done it, certainly not any of the other Espada.


Oh, oh! What do you think about the obvious parallels between the current battle with Ichigo and the girls, and the situation from back in HM with Zaraki rescuing Ichigo? Everyone can see the similarity, it's that obvious. :noes Is Kubo going somewhere with this?

Edit: Oh Minerva, congratulations for your 2000th post Nnoitra badge! :applause I wonder if it was intentional :heehee
Thanks. :wha

I wonder if Bel did that on purpose for me. I did tell him I was very happy about it once I saw. I don't want to give the badge up for the next level. :wah
 
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This FC has been inactive for a very long time. Please keep in mind that the limit is five FCs but if that is not a problem and you would like to take over this FC, please let me or another moderator know.


 
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Whoa. It's inactive because it isn't popular. It doesn't mean "inactive owner".
 
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I said "inactive FC" - I know that you are active, Minerva.

This FC obviously matters to you. I can sympathize - two of the FCs I own are very quiet as well. But they mean a lot to me.

If someone else is interested, maybe there is a possibility for a co-ownership. But that would be up to you.
 
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Well we got some NnoiTes this past month.

Kubo did the sketch with them in JET.
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It's not much, but every little bit is good. Still depicts them as having a close bond.
 

wanda lensherr

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Yes, his loyalty to Nnoitra and concern for Nnoitra is certainly his defining characteristics. We never did see any of the other Fraccion rushing to protect the Espada they serve from an attacker. :amuse And to face down Nnoitra explaining that he did it because he couldn't live with himself if something happened to Nnoitra. No one else would ever tell Nnoitra that they saved him because they care about him. No wonder Nnoitra backed off.

But then, it goes both ways. Nnoitra is certainly loyal to Tesra in return -- respecting Tesra's power to deal with Ichigo and handle any onlookers, discussing his plans with Tesra, actually trying to save Tesra when Zaraki showed up. Nnoitra would never do such things for anyone else. Tesra truly is the only person Nnoitra cares about.

Do you think we're ever going to see them again? Dying is not the same as dead lately, as we have seen with several other Arrancar. Now that the Arrancar are mainly on the protagonist side, I think that's a hopeful sign.
Yes i always did feel they were extremely loyal to each other almost compliment each other in a sense. I did notice the zaraki interventions brought out another side of Nnoitra. Especially with Tesra attack from his blade etc.
 
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